I am going on a hunt in a few weeks time. One of the things I do not have is a hunting knife. What to get?
The classic seems to be a simple fixed blade of around 4" cutting length.
Then of course you get the folders. Fits in your pocket, but easy to lose as well.
Would a "gut-hook" be practical in a hunting scenario?
Any advice?
Great question!
It depends on things like your planned usage of the knife as well as your personal preferences and capabilities.
And yes, a gut hook is a great tool, but I would prefer an extra tool for the job, like the Buck Paklite Guthook or the Morakniv Belly Opener. Later more on this.
To get down to business: the days of the "survivalist" one-knife-does-it-all are mostly over (for most of us under regular circumstances). When was the last time you gutted or butchered an animal in the field? For most of us, the most we do is to cut the throat after having shot the animal. For that, a simple Victorinox paring knife is enough - I laughed when I heard this at first, but it works! The carcass usually gets skinned by farm hands with the available farm equipment, so why would one even carry a hunting knife? It is close to carrying a camo-pattern jacket whilst on a bakkie hunt.
I have stopped carrying a real big hunting knife several years ago after I lost mine. Instead, I carry a Spyderco Resilience and a general purpose fixed blade (currently a Morakniv Companion) on a daily base. Over the last 7+ years I have never found this combination wanting. The Spyderco is on a pocket clip and the Morakniv tucked away in an IWB-holster.
If one plans to skin and prepare a carcass on your own, the scenario changes and thereby the equipment. I would still use a smaller, sharp blade to cut the throat if necessary. Heart and lung shots bleed out internally, so I don't think it is necessary to bleed them. Head shots is a different story - I prefer to bleed them if possible.
Then, for initial gutting, a dedicated gut hook. In total, it is faster and cleaner than anything else I have seen. Buy one, or make one from a large metal saw blade if necessary. I do not like the gut hooks on knife blades or handles - one does not get a proper grip, and the blade is almost always in the way.
For further gutting, a small sharp blade (3" - 4") with a slightly curved blade works well. With the Morakniv Companion I recently gutted two impalas in twenty minutes.
For skinning, I plan to make myself an ulu-type skinner along the lines of the Trophy Master knife set. A sheep skinner also works great.
For working the carcass I use a combination of a 6" butcher knife with a clipped point, as well as a boning knife and a No 66 Eclipse saw.
Last thoughts on a hunting knife (from a knife enthusiast ;) ) :
- Steel type is important. Many knife companies use 8Cr3MoV or something similar because it is cheap and works easy. I do not like this steel because it does not hold an edge properly.
- Crosscut of the blade is important. Get something with a full flat grind for all work except chopping.
I have carried a Victorinox for many years and it will suffice for basics. A medium sized knife is all you need and I concur with Ds J on his choices. A folder in a pouch on the belt is easier than a fixed blade. Weight is a factor when walking long distances.
I second DsJ's comment on the steel. it's well worth buying something made with a better quality steel especially if you intend keeping and using the knife. I have landed on D2 and near equivalents. It's harder to put an edge on than stuff like 8Cr3MoV but stands up to real work a great deal better.
Hunting knives are movie tools and at camp tools, for the bush and gutting there are a thousand big folding blades at every gun shop. A nice big folder, with a curved up point and not a sharp point (perces gut to often). The choice must have a clip on it for your belt.
Two things more important than knife choice !
A sharpening stone, rough type, not a honing stone NOT THE FINE RAZER EDGE PRODUCE STONE, the courser edge stone. These are available at engineering and some fishing shops, they often finger size.
I have a sharpener in my bag in my field bag and one on my shooting sticks.
Secondly, two knives - ALWAYS two knives.
I have a folding knife attached to my shooting sticks - I have a folding knife attached to my sling, I have a folding knife on my belt. I have a fixed blade on my gear lever and another two in my field bags, one my carry bag and one my vehicle bag.
I am curious what knives you are going to arrive here with ;D ;D ;D - I will loan you one of mine.
Aaag man Jan, when you get here you will see my set up and then see Cody set up and the different approaches.
Easiest way to sharpen and hone almost any steel knife is with sanding paper. I use 400 grit or 600 grit, and strop it afterwards. The downside for some is the slightly rounded cutting edge. I prefer it that way because it is stronger, keep a better edge and the process is much faster. The result is very similar to a japanese bevel.
What a rabbit hole!
Been doing some light reading with regards to the different types of steel and alloying elements, different opening and locking arrangements, edge geometry, toughness, hardness, edge retention and ease of sharpening.
Spent the last few days looking at what is available, made of steel that holds an edge well, with a full-flat grind, in a shape that I do not actively dislike and at a price I am willing to spend. Turn out that is not a very large selection.
Then my wife beat me to it by buying herself a Kershaw CQC-6K in D2 steel because it "felt nice in her hand".
Anyone know where we can get a "Stop the bleed" course in the Cape Town area?
Nice looking knife that.
My take on the subject:
A small knife is easier to carry - a folder is best.
A long blade is not needed. A 5cm blade is fine for gutting and cutting biltong.
A gut hook is useful.
Something like this:(https://edc-s.co.za/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/HB1263-3-scaled-1.jpeg)
I've been impressed with those Honey Badgers. The pivot bearing is super smooth and they have models in D2 steel. very good value for money imo.
D2 seems to be the best of the bottom end steels for knife blades. While it doesn't have the rust resistance of the more common stainless steels it more than make up for it by edge retention. At least, that is what the consensus is on the interweb.
As Ds J mentioned, I am only going to use the gut-hook infrequently. Rest of the time it'll catch on everything in my pocket. Of all the Youtube videos I've watched in the last few days, only Pieter Malan used one.
Quote from: janfred on Jul 04, 2024, 06:13 PMD2 seems to be the best of the bottom end steels for knife blades. While it doesn't have the rust resistance of the more common stainless steels it more than make up for it by edge retention. At least, that is what the consensus is on the interweb.
As with much of what's on the interwebs ITO opinion mine is worth 2c or less. There is the same sort of 'magical property' belief twaddle around knives as there is with calibres, gun cleaning potions and political leaders. Anyone that has found a real world shortcoming of D2 as a knife material and has therefore classed it as a bottom end steel is probably doing 'test to destruction' videos on yoochoob rather than actually using the knives in real life as knives.
Quote from: oafpatroll on Jul 04, 2024, 07:16 PMQuote from: janfred on Jul 04, 2024, 06:13 PMD2 seems to be the best of the bottom end steels for knife blades. While it doesn't have the rust resistance of the more common stainless steels it more than make up for it by edge retention. At least, that is what the consensus is on the interweb.
As with much of what's on the interwebs ITO opinion mine is worth 2c or less. There is the same sort of 'magical property' belief twaddle around knives as there is with calibres, gun cleaning potions and political leaders. Anyone that has found a real world shortcoming of D2 as a knife material and has therefore classed it as a bottom end steel is probably doing 'test to destruction' videos on yoochoob rather than actually using the knives in real life as knives.
Depends where you live and your lifestyle.
I carry a pocket knife every single day, live by the coast and spend a lot of time on the ocean. D2 rusts within a week, even when I try to baby it.
LC200n is my preferred steel. One knife for everyday carry and hunting.
Quote from: oafpatroll on Jul 04, 2024, 07:16 PMQuote from: janfred on Jul 04, 2024, 06:13 PMD2 seems to be the best of the bottom end steels for knife blades. While it doesn't have the rust resistance of the more common stainless steels it more than make up for it by edge retention. At least, that is what the consensus is on the interweb.
As with much of what's on the interwebs ITO opinion mine is worth 2c or less. There is the same sort of 'magical property' belief twaddle around knives as there is with calibres, gun cleaning potions and political leaders. Anyone that has found a real world shortcoming of D2 as a knife material and has therefore classed it as a bottom end steel is probably doing 'test to destruction' videos on yoochoob rather than actually using the knives in real life as knives.
There is - for most of us - one or two things which dictate the quality of a knife, may be three things.
- Keeping an edge with regular work. Most of us don't use knives to dig trenches and cut wood hence most of the available test are moot. Cutting meat, kitchen work and edc usage is enough testing. If one works with knives enough, the differences between better and worse types of steel become evident very soon. Please don't fall for the paper-cutting-test. A truly sharp knife can cut a free hanging human hair. A very sharp knife cuts through a free hanging plastic bag. If it shaves arm hairs, it is good to go.
- The design of the knife. One can do almost anything with almost any type of knife. How well the job will be done and how feasible it is, are subjects for another time. Fact is that some knife designs are thousands of years old because they work.
A bad or ineffective design usually only becomes evident with experience. What looks good does not necessarily works good. If I had to carry one knife for everything over the next few years I would probably choose beween a smaller kukri and a 5" clip point butcher's knife. - Edit: jager is correct: circumstances makes a big part of the choice. In Japan, the public may generally only edc a 6cm blade. In wet/salty circumstances, a proper stainless blade is a must.
Quote from: jager on Jul 04, 2024, 08:28 PMDepends where you live and your lifestyle.
I carry a pocket knife every single day, live by the coast and spend a lot of time on the ocean. D2 rusts within a week, even when I try to baby it.
Fair enough, living as I do on the highveld and doing almost all of my wingshooting in GP or the FS so rust on blades has never been a big issue except where I've been slack. I sweat like a horse though and anything carried in contact with my body, like a pistol for example, rusts in a matter of days unless very well protected. For that i have landed on Herschells Wax spray. The stuff is impressive and since I started using it on my carry gun the rust issue has been entirely eliminated. Well worth a look for stuff that you want to protect at the coast.
Quote from: oafpatroll on Jul 05, 2024, 08:29 AMQuote from: jager on Jul 04, 2024, 08:28 PMDepends where you live and your lifestyle.
I carry a pocket knife every single day, live by the coast and spend a lot of time on the ocean. D2 rusts within a week, even when I try to baby it.
Fair enough, living as I do on the highveld and doing almost all of my wingshooting in GP or the FS so rust on blades has never been a big issue except where I've been slack. I sweat like a horse though and anything carried in contact with my body, like a pistol for example, rusts in a matter of days unless very well protected. For that i have landed on Herschells Wax spray. The stuff is impressive and since I started using it on my carry gun the rust issue has been entirely eliminated. Well worth a look for stuff that you want to protect at the coast.
Ek het ook "aaphandjies" - alles roes! ;) ;)
I must say, I do a lot of kitchen work and meat cutting, and after trying a bunch of different brands of kitchen knives, I keep coming back to Victorinox, and occasionally Wusthof steel. The beauty of these metals, is that it is easy to sharpen. If you can't put an edge back on the blade with a few swipes from a steel rod, it isn't worth having. My favorite knives have lost a few mm of the blade over the years, but keep going strong.
I only wish I could find a folder like the above in the same steel. Many of the hunting knives are made from alloys that I'm not familiar with, and they often sharpen with great difficulty.
Problem with the easy-to-sharpen steels is that they become blunt easily as well According to the experts at least. Not a problem in a well run kitchen with the sharpening tool usually sold with the knive. Might be slightly inconvenient in the bush.
I have examples of both brands and neither could be accused of being a soft alloy. You can only make a decent knife work again with a steel if you don't let it go blunt in the first place. A steel is intended to do little more than 'ironing' the edge smooth, it's not for cutting a new one.
https://knifesteelnerds.com/2021/10/19/knife-steels-rated-by-a-metallurgist-toughness-edge-retention-and-corrosion-resistance/
Some light reading for those so inclined. In there it explains why certain steels sharpen easier. Also, through empirical testing proves that hardness and edge retention do not always correlate.
Jan, the needs of a "look at" and in use knife are same, but the one actually has to work regardless of its appearance. I have had some beautiful over the counter knives, but they are all lying somewhere in the bush, just where they landed. I must have thrown 3 - 4 knives over my shoulder because they were torture to use. ( I really mean thrown away - a pen, a lighter and a blade that are faulty must be GONE, not put away)
For the bush working knife you want a hard blade that holds a sharp edge, not that shave with fancy gone in 6 cm cutting a hog open kinda stuff. One of the absolute best steels other than craft made knives I have ever found is the old Opinel pocket knife, so much so, that Cody latched onto one at like 9 years old and pretty much never used anything else ever again.
I say again to you, more than one blade kept in more than one place on the hunt.
A small, small bladed knife is better.
Have a sharpener.
Forget about fancy edges, sharp is sharp.
Have a disposable carpet knife for opening a animal skin, it saves a sharp blade a lot.
Here is my setup, less spare blades and the Bowie Hunting Knife which hangs in the car on every hunt - never used, but always goes with - I mean you can not go hunting without a hunting knife now, can we ?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53837178043_7789128c99_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2q2pBnD)20240705_173230 (https://flic.kr/p/2q2pBnD) by David Frank Allen (https://www.flickr.com/photos/183810052@N07/), on Flickr
Of all the blades, the Opinel is most used, stays sharp and sharpens on anything. The one is attached to shooting sticks, another to my rifle sling, and another in a pocket.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53836922001_f08bcfa744_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2q2oig8)20240705_173348 (https://flic.kr/p/2q2oig8) by David Frank Allen (https://www.flickr.com/photos/183810052@N07/), on Flickr
Some of those cheap effective sharpening stones scattered through my stuff for easy use.
Do not over do the blade thing, just buy a cheap folding Dowe Knife at local sharp for now, use it, learn it and base your next buy on that learn.
First knife - ME - TO YOU - buy an Opinel R180 learn to use it, then we talk again.
Carpet knife - using the hooked carpet blades. Wonderful to gut with and the blade never seems to dull. Skinners that have used it have been full of praise.
Quote from: Againstthegrains on Jul 05, 2024, 01:52 PMI must say, I do a lot of kitchen work and meat cutting, and after trying a bunch of different brands of kitchen knives, I keep coming back to Victorinox, and occasionally Wusthof steel. The beauty of these metals, is that it is easy to sharpen. If you can't put an edge back on the blade with a few swipes from a steel rod, it isn't worth having. My favorite knives have lost a few mm of the blade over the years, but keep going strong.
I only wish I could find a folder like the above in the same steel. Many of the hunting knives are made from alloys that I'm not familiar with, and they often sharpen with great difficulty.
Agree- Victorinox has great steel, even the Swiss army knife.
Have you tried their big folders, or the Opinel? Their Lagoile version carries easier.
I know that Opinel is supposed to be good, but life is too short to have a wooden dowel with a blade attached. Might as well just sharpen a saw blade.
Quote from: janfred on Jul 06, 2024, 12:42 PMI know that Opinel is supposed to be good, but life is too short to have a wooden dowel with a blade attached. Might as well just sharpen a saw blade.
https://www.opinel.com/en/multifunction/n8-outdoor-blue
Check the Victorinox Hunter pro alox. I use it when hunting.
OK
So who are the best custom knife makers .. ( and why ) ?
Website and pictures please
Have a look at the assortment of knives.
https://www.knifeguy.co.za/collections/all-knives
Quote from: Newton on Jul 07, 2024, 12:30 PMOK
So who are the best custom knife makers .. ( and why ) ?
Website and pictures please
Hi Newton, it is a very difficult question to answer. The question is what you want, and what your budget is. Your location and preferences will probably play a role as well.
There are literally thousands of custom knife makers in SA, some forge and the most do stock removal. Some buy precut steel and finish it, while others wil make a complete new design for you.
What do you want? A good hunting knife, a gentleman's folder, or maybe an edc fighting knife?
custom knife makers are mostly hobbyist and hobbyist that are good enough to have people want to own their products-creations. They are mostly however guys that love making knives and experimenting with blades and handles, the selling finances the hobby.
There are two poles in knife makers, the guys that obsess with the steel type,quality, properties etc and the guys that obsess with handle materials, using 1000 year old wood or 6000 year old mammoth tusks.
The knife makers world is one of the most classical rabbit holes.
Quote from: Treeman on Jul 08, 2024, 07:36 AMcustom knife makers are mostly hobbyist and hobbyist that are good enough to have people want to own their products-creations. They are mostly however guys that love making knives and experimenting with blades and handles, the selling finances the hobby.
There are two poles in knife makers, the guys that obsess with the steel type,quality, properties etc and the guys that obsess with handle materials, using 1000 year old wood or 6000 year old mammoth tusks.
The knife makers world is one of the most classical rabbit holes.
Guilty as charged your Honor!
I make two knives a year at the very most. Usually it is one knife in two to three years. The handle material is whatever lies around, doesn't look too bad and will last. Since I mostly make working knives I truly don't see the sense in using some exquisite material which might be damaged on the second day of a hunt.
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 08, 2024, 01:56 PMQuote from: Treeman on Jul 08, 2024, 07:36 AMcustom knife makers are mostly hobbyist and hobbyist that are good enough to have people want to own their products-creations. They are mostly however guys that love making knives and experimenting with blades and handles, the selling finances the hobby.
There are two poles in knife makers, the guys that obsess with the steel type,quality, properties etc and the guys that obsess with handle materials, using 1000 year old wood or 6000 year old mammoth tusks.
The knife makers world is one of the most classical rabbit holes.
Guilty as charged your Honor!
I make two knives a year at the very most. Usually it is one knife in two to three years. The handle material is whatever lies around, doesn't look too bad and will last. Since I mostly make working knives I truly don't see the sense in using some exquisite material which might be damaged on the second day of a hunt.
Sounds like you are the ideal person to identify a practical hunting knive. You hunt and make knives.
What steel would you use for a hunting knive and what shape is practical?
1070 -1075 steel, superwood handle.
I've become a big fan of micarta type materials for handle scales. It's grippy as hell without needing to be excessively rough. Really easy to make too. I have a few carry knives with it on and when I rehandle the chopper I made that lives in my bakkie I'll do it with that. No idea what the steel alloy that that thing is made of other than it started out as a roller in a big ass roller bearing. I forged and heat treated it under the supervision of a knifemaker who offered courses 20 odd years back and it has proven to be as tough as its ugly. I can put a shaving edge on the thing and use it for a log weekend around the camp in place of a hatchet and it'll be back to shaving sharp within a minute with nothing more than a medium fine Lansky ceramic tri-stick.
I am not the most ideal person because my knowledge is dated, but will give a few thoughts.
Steel type: anything that can hold an edge. Panzer is said to be the very best of them all, so that would be my very first choice. Be prepared to pay for it, it was said to cost up to 3x the price of other steel. I have heard that it is tough to sharpen but cannot verify that.
D2 has a good name.
N690 has a good name, but I had a bad experience with it. Most probably a botched hardening job which caused a brittle blade, I could never sharpen it properly.
Lohman 458 is simply lovely - basically a stainless carbon steel with the best of both worlds combined.
Bearing steel is also superb, but tends to stain over time. As oafatrol said, it keeps an edge like few other steels. This would be my second choice.
Note: please see to it that the steel get hardened to a fitting degree. Victorinox and older Puma knives (German steel) are surprisingly soft, yet they keep an edge. It would not help to harden them too much.
My personal favourite is for harder steel (59 Rockwell), simply because it stays sharp longer. If kept sharp, one has a great cutting tool. Tool steel is great for this. I once made a knife from virgin leaf spring with which I cut a blue wildebeest from ear-to-ear with a single stroke. It is really possible.
As to the shape of the knife - it is difficult because preferences and applications differ. If I had to choose a single blade, I would probably prefer something along the lines of a clip point bowie, or a clip point butcher's knife, or even the more classical drop point hunter. 6-8 inches in length, 3mm thick and roughly 40-50mm high, depending on the shape.
I do not like a completely straight knife, but prefer a very slightly bowed down handle - a drop of 4-6mm is enough. The handle should be almost rectangular in cross cut with much rounded edges, up to the point that it is almost oval in shape. Have a look at a katana's handle. It works like a charm.
Between the handle and the blade I have been putting a finger groove much like a very oversized choil on most of my knives. This part of the blade never gets used, and the finger groove enables one to do fine work.
Full flat grind, or a Japanese bevel is my preferred crosscut. It is sharper, cuts easier and sharpens faster than anything else.
Handle material: micarta for the win! It is easy to work, cheap to replace etc. My preference is nonetheless for natural materials such as bone (shoulder bone of kudu), wood, and especially leather. Somehow they feel better.
Can't find any info on the net about Lohman 458. Closest is Lohmann 4528, and that is apparently a N690 analogue.
As for the Panzer, only reference I can find is panzer 36 and that the composition is pretty much the same as N690.
Thanks for the notes on the design. Helps to have a starting point.
Ds J rightly calls out the need for the heat treating to be done right. On the course I did years ago the smith showed me a bucket full of knives with failed heat treats. Some were too brittle and others too soft. He told me that the more Gucci the steel typically the more precisely the heat treat needed to be conducted. At that stage few smiths had the precise digital furnaces required to follow the specific recipes of the super steels. His point was that any steel could be buggered up with an inappropriate heat treatment so a maker using some fabulous steel was only doing the first half the job of achieving the desired performance. Even just overheating the blade while grinding can cook it such that the edge won't take a proper treat.
Quote from: janfred on Jul 09, 2024, 07:41 AMCan't find any info on the net about Lohman 458. Closest is Lohmann 4528, and that is apparently a N690 analogue.
As for the Panzer, only reference I can find is panzer 36 and that the composition is pretty much the same as N690.
Thanks for the notes on the design. Helps to have a starting point.
Lohman 4528 is correct. Sorry.
Panzer is a printed steel if I remember correctly. It makes for less impurities and better internal structure. This leads to better performance.
Our meat knives:
https://flic.kr/p/2q38suf
The top three are to break carcasses and remove cuts; the lower two to work the cuts.
- Kershaw skinner with acceptable gut hook. It is handy but does not keep a proper edge.
- Mundial Chef's Knife with adapted blade, finger groove and Japanese bevel. The finger groove is too small.
- Mundial Butcher's Knife with clipped point. The knife is too narrow to add a finger groove. This is a lovely shape and works well.
- Unknown brand (Mundial/Tramontina?) with clipped point and finger groove
- Carbon steel butcher's knife (Okapi?) with clipped point and stitched leather handle
A hunting knife would be based on the second and third knives, with some adjustments.
This is the handle design I spoke about previously. It was for a general purpose kitchen knife.
https://flic.kr/p/2q32h1Q
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 08, 2024, 07:28 AMWhat do you want? A good hunting knife,
Practical good looking hunting knife
I do NOT like rivets !
Quote from: Newton on Jul 09, 2024, 02:41 PMQuote from: Ds J on Jul 08, 2024, 07:28 AMWhat do you want? A good hunting knife,
Practical good looking hunting knife
I do NOT like rivets !
Please check this website, they have a thorough collection of examples of unriveted handles, blade designs etc: https://www.knifet.com/knife-parts-grinds-blade-shapes/
Do you have any particular idea or design in mind? I wouldn't mind making a few rough sketches.
(https://flic.kr/p/2q3keGH)
Ignore the middle one, as well as the rivets. The other two will work well.
https://flic.kr/p/2q3keGH
1883_profile.png
Got myself a Kershaw Dechutes Skinner.
D2 steel
Flat grind
Drop point
Large finger choil
Not the prettiest of knives, but seem to be very practical for slicing jobs.
Time will tell how practical it actually is. Thanks for the help.
will work everytime. Find a small water stone or 3 now and a large one.
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 10, 2024, 10:46 AM(https://flic.kr/p/2q3keGH)
Ignore the middle one, as well as the rivets. The other two will work well.
https://flic.kr/p/2q3keGH
I like the far left one
BUT
Here you go ...Jay Fisher - Fine Custom Knives Knife Anatomy, Parts, Names, Components, Definitions, and Terms (https://www.jayfisher.com/Knife_Anatomy_Parts_Names_Definitions.htm)
See Knife anatomy ten
Solid handle with bolted end cap ( or some similar form of locking )
I like the shape and form of the "Kershaw Dechutes Skinner" shown
I will have to do a bit of searching to find a picture of - "my-perfect-knife"
This
(http://static.wixstatic.com/media/017733_538a043e8ea94489b124e7b59bb0a205~mv2.jpg/v1/fill/w_1500,h_1004/BALETA%20Handmade%20-%20Hidden%20Tang%20Hunter%20Red%20Malee%2001.jpg)
Looks pretty good
Knife was made here - BALETA Handmade knives .... https://www.baletahandmade.com/
Use - Kameeldoring ( Camel Thorn Vachellia erioloba )
Here
Black Dragon Forge (https://www.blackdragonforge.com/)
are the SA - "main-dudes"
Small hidden tang hunting knife - hand made
Hidden tang - sectioned
(https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-7112541bb1f8f0b12a67ff74db21d0d6)
A few more photos
Hidden Tang buckeye wood (https://www.carterknifecompany.com/knife/hidden-tang-buckeye-wood)
(https://i.redd.it/w5mnrza6v6541.jpg)
Knife Tang types (https://huntinglot.com/knife-tang/)
I think I would like an extended tang with a "hammer pommel"
PM me for a full "wish-list" .... :)
https://heavinforge.co.za/
https://www.rutherfordforge.co.za/
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 13, 2024, 10:21 PMhttps://heavinforge.co.za/
https://www.rutherfordforge.co.za/
Interesting
Mostly folks offering expensive courses
The knives I see are fancy collectors items - NOT - normal working knives
If you want a cheap high quality custom made knife you need to find someone inexplicably desperate for money, suitably skilled and equipped or learn how to do it yourself. Knife making like pretty much all other crafts takes lots of time and money to perfect. The vast majority of opinionated knife experts I've met can't put an edge one one with a stone much less make one.
Quote from: Newton on Jul 14, 2024, 01:35 PMQuote from: Ds J on Jul 13, 2024, 10:21 PMhttps://heavinforge.co.za/
https://www.rutherfordforge.co.za/
Interesting
Mostly folks offering expensive courses
The knives I see are fancy collectors items - NOT - normal working knives
Partially correct; I know both of them, and they should be willing and able to make a you a proper hunting knife of your own design.
Yes, it will come at a price, but you will have one knife for life.
I have found that it is rather complicated buying a knife these days as the guy behind the counter is very "whats for sale is good".
The rep comes around and what he offers is good steel and good pinning and good sheath and and and - what's in stock is good.
I have also found that when you do find a decent known steel, like Kershaw or Puma or whatever, it becomes a very substantial investment, so much so that finding a non well known knife maker and getting a blade made is not such a bad idea.
Quote from: Shotofrank on Jul 14, 2024, 08:11 PMI have found that it is rather complicated buying a knife these days as the guy behind the counter is very "whats for sale is good".
Unfortunately, it is very much the same as with guns - the salesman is not necessarily clued up, or says what he has been told, or simply lacks experience.
Quote from: Shotofrank on Jul 14, 2024, 08:11 PMI have also found... that finding a non well known knife maker and getting a blade made is not such a bad idea.
Second this!
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 14, 2024, 06:59 PMPartially correct; I know both of them, and they should be willing and able to make a you a proper hunting knife of your own design.
Yes, it will come at a price, but you will have one knife for life.
How much exactly does that calculate to ?
Unfortunately a good nice useful knife attracts much temptation - too easy to steal , too easy to "misplace"
I do not want to be beholden to an inanimate object watching over it all the time. I also have more pressing needs for .. R5,000.00 - R15,000
Quote from: oafpatroll on Jul 14, 2024, 06:54 PMIf you want a cheap high quality custom made knife you need to find someone inexplicably desperate for money,
Are we not ALL "desperate for money" ?
In a free society of supply and demand and voluntary transaction .. it is up to the buyer and the seller to arrive at a price and transaction that satisfies both.
High end knife makers are trading on name and reputation - sort of like Mercedes / Holland and Holland / Nike / Levi / Gucci - they are in essence "luxury items"
Quote from: Newton on Jul 15, 2024, 03:52 PMQuote from: Ds J on Jul 14, 2024, 06:59 PMPartially correct; I know both of them, and they should be willing and able to make a you a proper hunting knife of your own design.
Yes, it will come at a price, but you will have one knife for life.
How much exactly does that calculate to ?
Unfortunately a good nice useful knife attracts much temptation - too easy to steal , too easy to "misplace"
I do not want to be beholden to an inanimate object watching over it all the time. I also have more pressing needs for .. R5,000.00 - R15,000
It depends on personal things like your pocket, taste and needs.
Knives start at R350, but mostly from R1200 upwards. I would prepare for R3500 to R5000 for a handmade knife. For a functional knife, I would not spend more.
The affordability is the reason why I buy a cheaper knife which can be replaced if it gets lost or stolen.
Pick your paddaslagter.
https://www.temu.com/ul/kuiper/un2.html?_p_rfs=1&subj=un-search-web&_p_jump_id=960&_x_vst_scene=adg&search_key=hunting%20knives&_x_ads_channel=bing&_x_ads_sub_channel=search&_x_ads_account=176511598&_x_ads_set=521046943&_x_ads_id=1321615357210376&_x_ads_creative_id=82601187496089&_x_ns_source=a&_x_ns_msclkid=311325c73a5c1fe0972343514dcfd68a&_x_ns_match_type=e&_x_ns_bid_match_type=bb&_x_ns_query=hunting%20knives&_x_ns_keyword=hunting%20knives&_x_ns_device=c&_x_ns_targetid=kwd-82602058543038%3Aloc-168&_x_ns_extensionid=&msclkid=311325c73a5c1fe0972343514dcfd68a&adg_ctx=f-69b4f298
when this guy gets here for the hunt, he had better have a bliksemse mooi knife - all this posting.
Quote from: Tripodmvr on Jul 16, 2024, 03:43 PMPick your paddaslagter.
No offence - but - would not think of buying any of those ...
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 15, 2024, 05:32 PMIt depends on personal things like your pocket, taste and needs.
Knives start at R350, but mostly from R1200 upwards. I would prepare for R3500 to R5000 for a handmade knife. For a functional knife, I would not spend more.
The affordability is the reason why I buy a cheaper knife which can be replaced if it gets lost or stolen.
I would think that most knife makers start off somewhere ..
I would further suggest that a number of knives must be made before "perfection" is reached.
Perhaps THIS is the point at which a reasonable good knife can be purchased - at a reasonable price ?
Quote from: Newton on Jul 16, 2024, 06:32 PMQuote from: Ds J on Jul 15, 2024, 05:32 PMIt depends on personal things like your pocket, taste and needs.
Knives start at R350, but mostly from R1200 upwards. I would prepare for R3500 to R5000 for a handmade knife. For a functional knife, I would not spend more.
The affordability is the reason why I buy a cheaper knife which can be replaced if it gets lost or stolen.
I would think that most knife makers start off somewhere ..
I would further suggest that a number of knives must be made before "perfection" is reached.
Perhaps THIS is the point at which a reasonable good knife can be purchased - at a reasonable price ?
In knife making, few things beat experience. To save money, I would rather have an easy / simple knife made by an experienced smith than a complicated knife by an inexperienced smith.
Quote from: Ds J on Jul 16, 2024, 10:36 PMIn knife making, few things beat experience. To save money, I would rather have an easy / simple knife made by an experienced smith than a complicated knife by an inexperienced smith.
contradiction in termsInexperienced smith is NOT going to be making a - complicated knife ..
What about an -
easy simple knife made by an "inexperienced" smith ? - at a very reasonable price ..
Quote from: Newton on Jul 17, 2024, 08:20 AMQuote from: Ds J on Jul 16, 2024, 10:36 PMIn knife making, few things beat experience. To save money, I would rather have an easy / simple knife made by an experienced smith than a complicated knife by an inexperienced smith.
contradiction in terms
Inexperienced smith is NOT going to be making a - complicated knife ..
What about an - easy simple knife made by an "inexperienced" smith ? - at a very reasonable price ..
I'll rephrase:
An inexperienced smith might try his hand at a complicated knife, and the results will show it.
Or, to save money, get an experienced Smith to make a simple knife (spend less time on it) and have a proper cutting tool.
Has anybody mentioned that your expensive knife is not to be given to the skinners. They sharpen on concrete slabs etc. I will not supply tissues.
Quote from: Tripodmvr on Jul 18, 2024, 01:19 PMHas anybody mentioned that your expensive knife is not to be given to the skinners. They sharpen on concrete slabs etc. I will not supply tissues.
I had that done to a Swiss Army Knife by one of the guys on my grandfathers farm when I was a kid. I couldn't believe how badly he'd butchered the thing and he couldn't make sense of my objection to the sterling job he'd done.
Quote from: Tripodmvr on Jul 18, 2024, 01:19 PMHas anybody mentioned that your expensive knife is not to be given to the skinners. They sharpen on concrete slabs etc. I will not supply tissues.
Two stories from our area:
I witnessed a skinner sharpening an old Wüsthof chef's knife on concrete. I went back and offered the farmer three Mundial / Tramontina knives in a swop; he agreed but he couldn't find it.
In another case, a farm worker was butchering a carcass with a Queen Steel hunting knife in fairly good condition. I tried to buy and swop, but he politely refused and stated clearly that his knife wasn't available. Three weeks later he lost the knife in the field somewhere.
The Kershaw knife performed adequately I think. The sheath worked well enough that I forgot it was on my belt. Only used it for gutting, but it had no problem with piglet, impala or large warthog boar skin. Even when bloody the handle wasn't slippery. The only complaint I can make is that the diamand pattern is difficult to clean once the blood has dried.
I did drop it tip first into the sand to Treeman's disgust. Learnt my lesson there.
We need the story of your hunt please.
I did drop it tip first into the sand to Treeman's disgust. Learnt my lesson there.
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The man took a brand new kershaw blade, held it shoulder height and dropped it point first into clay,8gravel old seabed ground, for f******sake 😤, like no man, just nooooo.
BUT!, The man can shoot, properly!