Sticky bolt of the other kind.

[big5ifty]

I just debugged another one of those 'gunsmith oversight' issues.

I'd bought a donor action, sent it to have a rifle built around it.

Fired two shots. Only two shots because of a different 'gunsmith oversight' - very bad fitting rail, I've already complained about that in another thread.

Came home with it, opened the bolt, and noticed the handle was moving but the bolt body was not. Phoned gunsmith, he explained that the handle is screwed on the bolt, and the loctite may have come loose, I should take it back and he would apply more loctite.

I said no problem, loctite I have, and know how to use, so I applied the loctite, screwed the bolt handle down to where it needs to be so the bolt can enter the action at the correct angle, and I assumed problem solved.

Took the rifle to the range to set zero, after correcting gunsmith oversight [ bad fitting, loose rail ].

No ignition. Firing pin drops, not hitting the primer. Stripped the bolt at the range, couldn't see what the problem was, packed it up.

After stripping the bolt, and seeing how the firing pin protrusion is actually adjustable on this, I measured protrusion and it was in spec, .045" . Then I was thinking along the lines of new spring.

After a while of prodding and poking, I noticed that the bolt handle stop was not against the action, about 10 degrees short of full close. What this does is prevent the firing pin from dropping fully, the cocking sleeve impacts on the bolt sleeve in the wrong place, so the pin was not hitting the primer at all.

The bolt was so tight at that point it felt like a hard stop.

Applying marking blue showed the bolt body was binding in the action.

The reason the handle came loose in the first place was probably due to me closing a bit past the point causing it to bind, and the force of opening it loosened the handle on the threads.

The reason it fired the first two shots was likely the bolt handle angle was a few degrees advanced out of place, giving the pin just enough protrusion to ignite the primer.

I used valve grinding compound on the bolt body around the section where it was binding, and got it to the point where the bolt handle is now closing on the bolt body.

Primer protrusion is measured and in spec, the cocking sleeve engaging the bolt sleeve correctly.

Now it just needs a good clean to make sure all the valve compound is gone.

[Treeman]

You sound like me on a good fix it night.

[janfred]

For proper headspace, the gunsmith should have closed the bolt on the gauges. As he did not find the binding problem, I suspect that you may be warping the action when torque is applied to the action screws.

Might be something for you to check before making irreversible changes to your action.

[big5ifty]

The rifle was built in one shop. Chambered, fitted, stocked, bedded and torqued by the shop.

I don't think a single action solid bottom action can bend under action screw torque.

I can understand how the problem was overlooked, if the bolt handle was already loose against the bolt body past a certain point on close, then engaged the bolt again when that point was returned to, it would have "closed" with the lugs 60% engaged, which is the point at which it was binding, and opened fine.

Any way, I've fixed it, I need to test it,  it's just another lesson learned.

I do want to put a pin through the bolt handle shroud where the bolt threads in, because if it comes loose, it will be possible to put a round in the chamber, close the bolt handle without the bolt body turning and lugs engaging, and the firing pin can still reach the primer.

[big5ifty]

For proper headspace, the gunsmith should have closed the bolt on the gauges. As he did not find the binding problem, I suspect that you may be warping the action when torque is applied to the action screws.

Might be something for you to check before making irreversible changes to your action.

It's a simple test, even after the fact, release the action screws, and see if there is any difference to how the bolt turns.

I've got the slightest resistance at the end of the bolt travel right now. If the action screws are bending the action, and I release them, the bolt should drop freely.

[big5ifty]

I suspect that you may be warping the action when torque is applied to the action screws.

I've released the action screws, the bolt rotation doesn't change, It's the same torqued as un-torqued.

[janfred]

Perhaps just let us know what action you used.

[big5ifty]

RSA single shot, bought second hand, donor rifle was chambered in .308.

The rifle went directly from the seller to the gunsmith.

[oafpatroll]

I'd imagine that must be on the high end of rigid actions.

[janfred]

I photo showing where the bolt body binds would be helpful.

Cant be a standard bolt. They are cast and machined. None of the 4 models currently in my safes have a screw-in bolt handle.Also, the slop inherent in the design precludes any binding in the action.

A common mod done to RSA actions is to drill and tap two aditional holes in front of the trigger in line with the holes of the trigger guard. Some users was of the opinion that using the tang and recoil lug screw points would warp the actions.

[big5ifty]

None of the 4 models currently in my safes have a screw-in bolt handle

This bolt handle is not screw in.

The whole bolt body is 'screw in'.



This is exactly it. The bolt handle is on a collar. The bolt body is screwed into that collar. On the underside, there is a recess in that collar that the cocking sleeve slots into. If the bolt/collar is turning against the bolt without the bolt moving, ie : screwing the bolt further into the collar, the cocking sleeve can travel fully forward with the lugs not engaged, or at the very least not fully engaged.

[janfred]

Can you show on the photo where the bolt body was binding?

[big5ifty]

from the bolt collar, for a 3cm distance, over the width of the bottom of the action

an area of contact, not a point

what is the significance ?

[janfred]

I am trying to get my head around how your action or bolt got so warped that the bolt binds in the action. How bad was your gunsmith?

In my experience, there are generous tolerances around the bolt to avoid this exact scenario. Added to this is that I have never seen a RSA bolt with a threaded bolt handle "collar" that needed to be locktighted onto the bolt.

Was the action screw mod done to your action?
Is this an aftermarket bolt?

[big5ifty]

What is a bad gunsmith. If this qualifies a gunsmith as bad, then I've never been to a good one, because every one I've ever dealt with gives me a rifle that I need to work on to get working properly, except Craig Clintworth.

My understanding is that all RSA action bolt bodies are threaded. If they are or not, I can't say, I have one other that looks different, it doesn't have the mauser claw, it has the same handle with threaded collar.

If yours look like this, it's threaded together.

Where the thing came from and how it came to be is not the issue, the issue is 'gunsmith oversight', of which this is just one example, the most recent for me.