Loads for .410 - 2 inch shells?

[Ds J]

Good evening Folks, I couldn't get shotgun cases to fit, so I measured the chambers of our .410 SxS shotgun. It turns out the old lady has 2-inch chambers.

It means I would need to reload. Any advice on loads, shot etc?

Using proper cups is out of the question, simply due to the lack of space.

How do I proceed without blowing up anything?

The Somchem table shows 12.3gr - 15.4gr S265 behind 12g #6 shot, but this is for 65mm cases.

[BBCT]

Have you Googled to see if there's any info eg from USA, which would give you a starting point for charge and shot weight. Substitute closest locally available equivalent powder with a minimum load and start testing.........

What cases do you have? I'm wondering if you could use 44Mag cases with those plastic snakeshot capsules. I've also got some fired .410 cases, mostly 3" but also some 65mm and probably some 2" if you need. You could always trim the longer ones to length.

[Treeman]

Its actually not so daunting after a few tries, take the entry load for the 2.5 an test that with a lighter load, then up the load weight. I do not know how to explain, but you get a feel for it rather quickly, the upper end of the loads that is, the bottom side you just go in really low. I gave you cork for wads, you work out your loads, fill case, measure the excess space and fill that with cork. You then break down the cartridge and weigh the cork, the cork weight is then removed from the load weight.

It is easier to start with a higher charge and lighter load than it is to have a heavier load and trying to load up to its levels. I think I gave you a book of loads, they all a bit short in fill length and needed spacing to fill case. Take my loads drop 15 % for own get the feeling of it all.   

[Ds J]

Gold!

https://www.fourten.org.uk/light.html

[oafpatroll]

If I had a 410 that needed feeding I'd be interested in going down the 303 brass conversion route rather than messing about with used 410 hulls.

 

[Treeman]

For those two inch chambers, this is the ONLY way to go. Collect all the old Berden throw aways stuff, pay once or do it yourself, do the primer pockets and you have cases for a 100 reloads per case.
You can anneal the whole body every 6-7 reloads.
I did give you some brass cases from .303

[Ds J]

Good evening Folks, I have had a delightful day - partially with the family and partially on research for the .410 2-inch.

Dr Google is your friend, and I spoke to an experienced 410 2-inch reloader. He basically confirmed what Dr Google told me.

In practical terms it boils down to the following basics, especially for our SA situation:

• .410 2" ammunition can be imported from Europe; budget for R500/25 and a looong wait
• use 444 Marlin brass if possible, especially when starting from new
• brass hulls are much easier to work with, mostly because they need no crimp
• 303 brass works well, the only hiccups are the thicker rim and to centre them properly on fireforming - wrap the case in a single layer of masking tape
• 10-13grains of S265
• 9-10grams of shot
• finer shot is generally better - #8 or #9 if possible
• cork or fibre wads over the powder, cardboard wads glued in place over the shot
• some shotguns prefer shot cups, others not

Below is a selection of comments, ideas, suggestions etc which I collected from the internet regarding 410 2-inch reloading:

[30-06 11:01]: Originally the .410 was designed to fire a 2 in. cartridge loaded with approximately 5/16 oz. of shot.

[30-06 11:33]: Here I'd suggest the ideal solution is the Eley Hawk two-inch .410, which delivers a 9gm payload of No. 6 shot." ~ Shooting Times

Loaded with a very special SSB+ 150 powder the 2" cartridge is ideal for use on ground game and vermin

[30-06 11:42]: Originally introduced in the 1890s, as a 2inch cartridge with a 3/8th ounce charge of shot, it became more popular with the introduction of a 21/2" cartridge with a 1/2 ounce and, in 1924, the 3" cartridge with 3/4 ounce of shot

[30-06 11:53]: British standard 2" load is 5/16th. ounce of shot

[30-06 12:02]: Historically the 2-inch .410-bore carried 3/10 ounce of shot, but U.S. Cartridge Co. put 3/8 ounce in a 2-inch brass case. That 3/8 ounce was the original 2 1/2 inch paper case load.

[30-06 12:04]: ole' smith at gander mtn. said them "antique" ones had tighter chambers and bores to provide better seal against gases getting past the wad. shotgun ammo sucked back in those days.

[30-06 12:05]: I don't think you'll have room for any kind of shot cup. I'd suggest using 296(dense) powder and a cardboard over powder wad, that's all.

[30-06 12:06]: I've been using 13.8 grains of 296 in AA casas for many years. The recommemded 14 grains goes over 1200 fps. I prefer 1150 or thereabouts, with all my loads.

[30-06 12:08]: An old Lyman manual I have for the 2½" .410 with 3/8oz shot recommended 7grs "Infallible" or 10grs "Herco". Infallible was a powder virtually identical to "Unique". In the 2" case using the cut-back plastic wads per 8-bores recommendation I would think 6grs Unique or 8 grs Herco would be very efficient loads for the 3/8oz load. Due to the small dia of the bore Load Density (shot wt/bore area) changes rapidly with only small changes of weight. I would not really think the very slow ".410 Powders" would necessarily be the most desirable for only 3/8oz charges. This Unique loading is often quoted as a suitable charge for loading in .45 Colt case for firing from the SAA incidently.

[30-06 12:54]: I use any standard pressure .44-40 charge which is safe for a 215-grain lead bullet in the Winchester 1873 or Colt SA Frontier Six Shooter, typically 6 grains of Bullseye, 7 grains of Unique, 8 grains of Herco, 15 grains of #2400 or 17 grains of 4227 using a Buffalo Arms card over the powder and a 3/8" waxed fiber cushion wad with 1/2oz. of shot. I use an overshot card for a .44 cal. , roll crimp and seal with brushing lacquer.

[30-06 13:02]: Appropriate powders are "slow burning" by shotgun standards, and some specialty .410 loads use propellants usually reserved for the larger shotgun shells. Actually, the judicious .410 handloader could get by with just Winchester 296, Hodgdon H110, and Alliant 2400. One or the other of this trio will work in just about any case with any load.

[30-06 13:09]: The .410's metier is skeet shooting, and the vast majority of 2.5-inch shells are loaded with No. 9 shot at about 1,200 fps. Such ammo is easy to duplicate.

[30-06 13:24]: The 21/2-inch field loads offered by several companies with Nos. 4, 6 and 71/2 shot are poor choices for hunting due to the low pellet count. Clay target loads of the same length such as the Remington STS, Federal Gold Medal and Winchester AA loaded with No. 81/2 or 9 shot are deadly on woodcock in the timber and quail on preserves.

[Ds J]

I am not yet sure what works better: roll crimping a plastic case, or glueing a brass case.

[oafpatroll]

I roll crimp all my slug and buck 12g loads and they work well. For a 410 roll crimper speak to Kevin at Bushmunki - kevin@bushmunki.co.za

[Ds J]

Good Evening Folks,

I need to test a thought: would it be possible to resize .410 2-inch cases with a 308 sizing die?

The .410 2" case falls from .470" to .455" over 2 inches.

The 308 falls from .4709" to .4539" over 1.56".

Theoretically, the first 1.5" should be pressed to almost/slightly below factory specs, or not?

[BBCT]

Good Evening Folks,

I need to test a thought: would it be possible to resize .410 2-inch cases with a 308 sizing die?

The .410 2" case falls from .470" to .455" over 2 inches.

The 308 falls from .4709" to .4539" over 1.56".

Theoretically, the first 1.5" should be pressed to almost/slightly below factory specs, or not?

I would just do it and see what happens............

[Ds J]

Feedback: the 308 Win FL-die works like a charm!

Cut back the brass cases to 51mm, anneal them slightly, and form them in the 308 die.

They fit tightly into the .410 chambers - I am sure they will fireform precisely.

[Treeman]

Feedback: the 308 Win FL-die works like a charm!

Cut back the brass cases to 51mm, anneal them slightly, and form them in the 308 die.

They fit tightly into the .410 chambers - I am sure they will fireform precisely.

***************************
That is just amazing, no other mention of that ever read anywhere.
I AM IMPRESSED>

[oafpatroll]

Feedback: the 308 Win FL-die works like a charm!

Cut back the brass cases to 51mm, anneal them slightly, and form them in the 308 die.

They fit tightly into the .410 chambers - I am sure they will fireform precisely.

Feedback: the 308 Win FL-die works like a charm!

Cut back the brass cases to 51mm, anneal them slightly, and form them in the 308 die.

They fit tightly into the .410 chambers - I am sure they will fireform precisely.

***************************
That is just amazing, no other mention of that ever read anywhere.
I AM IMPRESSED>

Likewise, first time I have heard of it and I spent a lot of time googling 410 reloading options. You heard it here first Folks!

[Ds J]

Edit: I doubt that the 308 die will work with regular 2½ and 3" shells.