dirty meat and shot placement

[Treeman]

I am tired of dirty meat, cutting away blood meat, then washing and more cutting to get the half digested grass out of wherever it's been blown into.
Cody and I are meat hunters, so full on shoulder shots are really not an option. We have tried double lung shots, through one shoulder in and out behind far side shoulder, behind one in and out on far side in shoulder. We have tried full frontal and we tried in behind last rib and out on far side shoulder, shot placement we have tried in excess - much.
Everytime its either blood meat or gut content in the wound channel or surrounds, and it sucks to work such an carcass. The clients are now told "in on the shoulder bone and out on or behind other side shoulder" - sorry about the meat loss.
I do a lot of headshots, but they are almost entirely on those get lucky at 80 m here pops a head out looking other direction cases - freehand shooting. Lovely clean carcass and no meat damage.

I have been talking to Cody about taking lower neck shots, in front of the shoulder from the side and above the line of the spine if from front or back. The frontal or facing away shots are pretty safe, if you hit the neck its dead, the side on shots I am still pondering.
Tonight we again looked at a carcass we were working and discussed the matter in detail, what shots to take and where to put the bullet. 

Who here shoots neck shots ? Tell me about neck shots.

[Ds J]

Agree, body shots are bloody and wasteful even though they are surer and easier. A neck shot - in my little experience with them - can be just as bloody and gooey as a shoulder shot. However, the bloody area and wasted meat is much less, and the larger cuts of meat are clean.

I have not taken many neck shots, but they are usually slightly easier than a head shot, simply because the neck does not move so much and the target area is slightly bigger.

In the upper neck area, they go down to stay down. It must have something to do with the shock to the medula oblongata.

[oafpatroll]

In the upper neck area, they go down to stay down. It must have something to do with the shock to the medula oblongata.

I wonder if it might have something to do with a pressure wave in the blood so close to the brain?

[Treeman]

In the upper neck area, they go down to stay down. It must have something to do with the shock to the medula oblongata.

I wonder if it might have something to do with a pressure wave in the blood so close to the brain?

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no ! - It is simply the destruction of the spine, central nervous system.
Only 2 + 1 ways to kill.
Damage to nerve system
Loss of blood
Destruction of a vital organ, but that is by the result of one of the 2 above mentioned.

[Tripodmvr]

Everybody proposes head shots for clean meat. Lately I have shot three impala with neck shots just below the head. There is only 1 cm of meat on either side of the vertebrae and is a safe shot. It also looks neater than a head shot animal with eyes popping out. The easiest is with the animal looking away as the nose and teeth are out of the way.

[oafpatroll]

In the upper neck area, they go down to stay down. It must have something to do with the shock to the medula oblongata.

I wonder if it might have something to do with a pressure wave in the blood so close to the brain?

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no ! - It is simply the destruction of the spine, central nervous system.
Only 2 + 1 ways to kill.
Damage to nerve system
Loss of blood
Destruction of a vital organ, but that is by the result of one of the 2 above mentioned.

I was meaning where the spine hasn't been destroyed. Mate of mine does harvesting, sometimes from helicopters and has shot dozens of animals a day on occasion. He shoots head and neck shots exclusively to spare meat and says that he's had bokkies drop where the spine has not been severed. I'm talking here about shots that are within centimetres of the brain but have hit neither it nor the spine.

[Treeman]

[/quote]

I wonder if it might have something to do with a pressure wave in the blood so close to the brain?
[/quote]
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no ! - It is simply the destruction of the spine, central nervous system.
Only 2 + 1 ways to kill.
Damage to nerve system
Loss of blood
Destruction of a vital organ, but that is by the result of one of the 2 above mentioned.
[/quote]

I was meaning where the spine hasn't been destroyed. Mate of mine does harvesting, sometimes from helicopters and has shot dozens of animals a day on occasion. He shoots head and neck shots exclusively to spare meat and says that he's had bokkies drop where the spine has not been severed. I'm talking here about shots that are within centimetres of the brain but have hit neither it nor the spine.
[/quote]
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if he is doing neck shots from a heli, they use shotguns, shotguns multiple wounds disrupt the nervous system causing death. That said, I think a supersonic bullet passing a cm from the spine will still cause severe terminal damage to the system - shutdown.

[Treeman]

There is only 1 cm of meat on either side of the vertebrae and is a safe shot. It also looks neater than a head shot animal with eyes popping out. The easiest is with the animal looking away as the nose and teeth are out of the way.

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Yes, this is my chosen "head shot" that you describe, I seldom aim at the head itself - usually the head from behind through neck. If you hit, its down and over and if you miss its a total miss.

The shot I am wanting to explore is the low neck front of shoulders, for those longer shots.

[oafpatroll]

if he is doing neck shots from a heli, they use shotguns, shotguns multiple wounds disrupt the nervous system causing death. That said, I think a supersonic bullet passing a cm from the spine will still cause severe terminal damage to the system - shutdown.

The choppers aren't what they use most of the time but when they do he shoots a stubby barrelled lightweight savage bolt action in 6.5 creed of all things. 

[Treeman]

if he is doing neck shots from a heli, they use shotguns, shotguns multiple wounds disrupt the nervous system causing death. That said, I think a supersonic bullet passing a cm from the spine will still cause severe terminal damage to the system - shutdown.

The choppers aren't what they use most of the time but when they do he shoots a stubby barrelled lightweight savage bolt action in 6.5 creed of all things. 

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   Yoh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! man must be quite able with a rifle.

[Againstthegrains]

One problem that I can foresee is that if you miss the spine, the shock to the CNS from a bullet hitting close to the CNS is enough for the animal to drop on the spot. Then you go up to it to cut the throat etc, and it suddenly gets up and runs away because it was just stunned, and not killed. I have seen this happen a few times on animals where a bullet comes close but doesn't damage the CNS.

Then again, to stir a bit with Treeman :

1. a 270 win is fast and therefor terrible with respect to meat damage it causes.
2. lead cup and core bullets kill the best, but are the worst for meat damage
3. point 1&2 and synergistic

[Treeman]

1. a 270 win is fast and therefor terrible with respect to meat damage it causes.
2. lead cup and core bullets kill the best, but are the worst for meat damage
3. point 1&2 and synergistic

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I think almost any bullet, if it hits that last part of the neck would be a killer. There is just so "no nothing" else in that small space, just dead if touched stuff.
 Add a cup and core bullet and its even deader.

[Againstthegrains]

I agree, for anything CNS a fast frangible bullet works best. You might miss the brain or spinal chord, but there are often enough small bullet fragments to go astray, and do the necessary.

[Treeman]

Guys, I have a problem ! This 7mm08 of Cody's is just causing so much meat damage - I just can not work it out.
 Animal is Impala - fallow deer
 7 mm Hornady Interlock 154 gr
velocity  5 m = 2650 fps
average shot distance 80 -130 m
meat damage 30 cm every direction from hole - yet we are often recovering reasonably well held together mushroomed bullets,its not like they splattered or impact was like 3000 fps - my .270 is fairing better meat damage wize.
What is going on here.
20231216_104248 by David Frank Allen, on Flickr
20230717_205227 by David Frank Allen, on Flickr

[Ds J]

I have had the same with 308, 180gr @ 2400fps.