Growwer doppies (scotchbrite)

[Ds J]

Goeienaand, ek het êrens gelees dat te blink en gladde doppe sleg is vir 'n geweer. Die doppe klou nie mooi in die kamer nie en skop dan met hoër druk teen die slot vas.

Sou die teenoorgestelde help - dws dat n mens die doppe met 'n skuursponsie afskuur om hulle skoon te kry, en dan net so los? Die dop is skoon en bietjie grof, en pas nogtans in die kamer. Teoreties sou die dop dan beter vasklou?

[oafpatroll]

Ek het nooit 'n nuwe militêre of siviele patroon wat grof was gesien nie so ek twyfel of daai storie waar is.

[Treeman]

Ek het nooit 'n nuwe militêre of siviele patroon wat grof was gesien nie so ek twyfel of daai storie waar is.

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Ya nee, daai klinl soos a vuurplek storie.

DsJ, I think you can compare the smooth case working better to the same reason slick tires have more grip,- surface area!

I think it's a case of cohesion beats adhesion beats created friction.

[janfred]

Skoon blink doppies is goed. En klou beter as growwe doppies. Die probleem kom met doppies wat blink as gevolg van olie of was.

[big5ifty]

I read something once, about cartridges lubricated to increase bolt thrust when proofing loads.

[oafpatroll]

I read something once, about cartridges lubricated to increase bolt thrust when proofing loads.

It certainly does that. On a trip down a historical rabbit hole I was reading a pre WW1 era UK War Ministry procedure for proofing 303s. They made a firm point of ensuring that the proof rounds and chamber were in no way contaminated with oil or grease as that would invalidate the procedure due to the increase in pressure against the bolt. I forget what they said the increase may amount to but it was very significant.

Since reading that I've often wondered about how much extra wear and tear rifles take as a result of shooters leaving the chambers oily after cleaning and lubing. 

[Treeman]

I read something once, about cartridges lubricated to increase bolt thrust when proofing loads.

It certainly does that. On a trip down a historical rabbit hole I was reading a pre WW1 era UK War Ministry procedure for proofing 303s. They made a firm point of ensuring that the proof rounds and chamber were in no way contaminated with oil or grease as that would invalidate the procedure due to the increase in pressure against the bolt. I forget what they said the increase may amount to but it was very significant.

Since reading that I've often wondered about how much extra wear and tear rifles take as a result of shooters leaving the chambers oily after cleaning and lubing. 

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You and I have it seems the same thought patterns. I have often wondered how much oily chambers and cases have influenced the  life span and history of cartridges. How many rifles were old before their time and how many old calibres got a bad rap because of bolt thrust being compromised by oiled chambers.
 BUT THEN ! - there are articles advocating the lubeing of cases like the .303  so that the case expands correctly on first firing.

[big5ifty]

- there are articles advocating the lubeing of cases like the .303  so that the case expands correctly on first firing.

There are many echo chambers on the internet. People parroting each other, lower subscriber counts imitating higher subscriber counts for more subscribers, each presenting the same flawed opinion or method, repeating the same inaccuracies.

Apply common sense in all cases.

A lubed case can't grip the chamber walls on expansion, so there is some extra force straight back.

How much, and is it bad ? How much lube ? How tapered is the case ? A lot of going around in circles.

There is no good reason to leave lube on cartridges or oil in the chamber. That is just careless.

You provide surfaces to which dust, dirt and grit will transfer, stick and accumulate. 

[Tripodmvr]

A very lengthy discussion on lubricating of cartridges.

https://www.jouster2.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-57788.html

[oafpatroll]

- there are articles advocating the lubeing of cases like the .303  so that the case expands correctly on first firing.

There are many echo chambers on the internet. People parroting each other, lower subscriber counts imitating higher subscriber counts for more subscribers, each presenting the same flawed opinion or method, repeating the same inaccuracies.

There is so much BS on discussion forums dealing with subjects that I am interested in that I stay away from the majority of them. The ubiquitous access that we now have to 'information' via all manner of online channels make many Walter Mitty-ish people imagine they are competent to hold forth on subjects they actually know virtually nothing about.
An example that stands out was when I was down the cast and powder coated centre-fire rifle bullet rabbit hole while developing loads for my .270 Win. I started by obtaining copies of cast bullet manuals including a fairly recent Lyman edition that included load data for two of the molds I had and one of the powders. When I posted a question to castboolits one of the Mittys with a really high post count spewed forth a recipe that included a seriously oversized bullet with a >30% charge weight over the Lyman published max. I don't know that it would have necessarily been dangerous but it was definitely BS.

[big5ifty]

https://www.jouster2.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-57788.html

There is reference to .303, and using lube to avoid case head separation.

Proper brass sizing in relation to the chamber avoids case head separation. In all instances. This is proven.

Pick a box of factory ammo. Any ammo, any manufacturer, any caliber, any year of manufacture, since metallic cartridges were invented. Look for lube on the cases.

That should give a clue.

[Tripodmvr]

The 303 cartridges and action were normally manufactured so that in poor conditions (trench warfare) the ammo would chamber and shoot. Cases were not reloaded and therefore chambers were big. We now try and reload for such a problem child and suffer with case separation.

I recall reading of a machinegun in 303 that suffered with case separation due to violent extraction. Here they experimented with lubed cases, but the design was dropped for arms that did not need the complicated procedure.

[janfred]

Yes, some machine guns were designed to use lubricated ammunition. As such they did not work well with dry ammo. Then you uave the five-seven that have cases covered in a dry lube. It cannot function with unlubricated cases.

Point I am trying to make is these arms were made to uses lubricated ammunition. Normal guns we use are nut designed to run like that.